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theory on howe



theory on howe

Postby poodeeo » Wed Apr 10, 2002 6:07 am

Ok, we all know Steve had a lot of jazz influence. Who out there knows and can explain Steve's voicing, phrasing, etc, in terms of jazz theory, ie scales? Anybody?
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Postby IngnoZac » Thu Apr 11, 2002 8:52 am

I know it isn't exactly what you're looking for, pood, but look for 'howe wakeman interview' on AG. They're talking about Heart of the Sunrise and I remember Steve plays something in the end and talks a little about. It's about 2 minutes long I think.

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Postby Dr_Yes » Thu Apr 11, 2002 9:57 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
<b>poodeeo wrote:</b>
Ok, we all know Steve had a lot of jazz influence. Who out there knows and can explain Steve's voicing, phrasing, etc, in terms of jazz theory, ie scales? Anybody?
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></font id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Only just seen this poodeeo and I haven't had chance to give it thought, but one of the most obvious influences in terms of phrases comes from Wes Montgomery who Steve saw in, I think he said in one book in 1965, and was very impressed by his unison octave movement. This is I guess you've heard too clear in the solo of Yours is no Disgrace when he's improvising in the middle. Other than that I think he favours the Mixolydian scale quite a lot but I'm not that good with theory so I'll leave it to people who are!
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Postby IngnoZac » Fri Apr 12, 2002 1:28 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
<b>Dr_Yes wrote:</b>
I think he favours the Mixolydian scale quite a lot but I'm not that good with theory so I'll leave it to people who are!
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></font id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

I hate the name of the greek modes. I just call them X-maj scale starting on I, II, III, IV, V, VI or VII!!! I hate all these tech terms... Music isn't about memorizing hard names and what they are. Music is what you hear in silence.

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Postby guilddigger » Fri Apr 12, 2002 2:37 am

<font face='Comic Sans MS'>i agree with you renato, music becomes too theoretic when discussed like that. i call all the scales the dyslectic scales ´cause i have not a clue what they´re called and i have no interest learnin them. play from the heart and play by ears.




</font id='Comic Sans MS'>

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Postby Dr_Yes » Fri Apr 12, 2002 4:31 am

Hey guys, keep your hair on. It's only a bit of 'grammar' so that you know what someone means. Sure it wouldn't matter if it were the Flyghanfanchian minor scale so long as you know how it SOUNDED, but then it's easier to communicate it via a keyboard using its given signifier rather than try to write it down in terms of a sound - surely?

And grammar's not such a bad thing in terms of at least having a general comprehension. For example, if you had no grammar with which to express your speech coherently 'say garbage as then you comes everything out' <img src=pix/icon_smile.gif border=0 align=middle> or to put it better 'then everything you say comes out as garbage'.
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Postby Roundabout » Sun Apr 14, 2002 11:16 am

btw could any of you tell me how do you play that scale?? i only use the pentatonic and the diatonic...
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Postby Dr_Yes » Mon Apr 15, 2002 4:45 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
<b>Roundabout wrote:</b>
btw could any of you tell me how do you play that scale?? i only use the pentatonic and the diatonic...
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></font id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

It's easy Roundabout. Take your diatonic (major) scale - for example the key of 'C'.

I II III IV V VI VII VIII
C D E F G A B C

The intervals here are Tone - Tone - Semitone - Tone - Tone - Tone -Semitone. Right? Familiar?

Okay the Mixolydian mode is simply found by starting the scale on the fifth (V) - or in this case G. If you play the notes through you'll see the intervals between them has changed.

I II III IV V VI VII VIII
G A B C D E F G

The new pattern of intervals <b></b>T-T-S-T-T-S-T<b></b> is the characteristic of the Mixolydian mode, and is a major mode similar to your diatonic major but importantly with a flattened 7th note.

Obviously you could start this in any key to suit your music.

i.e. D mixolydian

I II III IV V VI VII VIII
D E F# G A B C D

Now your job is to prove whether or not Steve does employ a flattened 7th a lot!!
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Postby perpetualchanger » Sun May 12, 2002 4:06 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
<b>Dr_Yes wrote:</b>
Other than that I think he favours the Mixolydian scale quite a lot but I'm not that good with theory so I'll leave it to people who are!
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></font id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

My theory is rusty - very rusty - but you are right about that much.

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