Holy Rollers and Music: Less Crap--More Filling

by **N2yes** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 12:58 pm

Okay, your next installment of "Holy Roller Crap" is primed and ready for input. Remember, if you will, a certain children's choir that was the original target of this thread? Well, an occasional referrence to this very point might serve to remind folks of the fact that YES was at the very core of this topic at one time. Should it return to these 'roots', all the better! Still, feel free to deviate from time-to-time as a little free-form expression is good for the soul.<img src=pix/icon_yes_talis.gif border=0 align=middle>

<hr>"Master of images-Songs cast a light on you"

by **Megalodon** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 4:45 pm

N2, I think you made a good call by locking the other topic,
as some of those discussions can go around in circles and not
really accomplish much. I admit, I took a big part in those
discussions, but there can be too much ground to cover by trying
to answer questions from numerous people or to make a reply to
them. I thought you did a great job keeping an eye on that thread
and you carefully let it run it's coarse for a while. Good Job!!
Mosts message boards do not tolerate those subject matters, but
we here at Yes Talk seemed to keep the disscussion civilized, and
the board members are to be commended for that. Yes Fans seem to
be pretty tame and cool people.<img src=pix/icon_smile_cool.gif border=0 align=middle>

by **Terry Shea** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 11:11 pm

I just hope this doesn't turn into another Christian bashing thread. I may have lost my patience with a few people on the other thread and I'm sorry about that, but I'm sick and tired of all this constant Christian bashing. Why is it socially acceptable to bash Christians and not acceptable to bash other groups? If a Nazi or a KKK member wants to express his viewpoint he's protected by free speech and allowed to speak freely no matter how hateful his message is. If a Christian wants to express his viewpoint he's told to shut up and quit preaching, has his words twisted and manipulated and has to try to explain every verse in the Bible that someone decides to take out of context.

<hr>Listen to my music by clicking on one of these links:
http://www.ampcast.com/terry_shea
http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?so ... 268&T=3529
http://www.clearchannelnewmusicnetwork. ... /terryshea
http://www.mp3.com/terry_shea

by **tardistraveler** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 12:15 am

Well, are we going down the road of free speech now? I expect if Nazis or the KKK were to speak out, they would take their share of bashing also. Free speech is just that - people have a right to speak their minds, and consequently people have a right to disagree. Simple as that.

To get back to the original topic, YesWorld has some information on the newly recorded tracks - check it out!

by **Megalodon** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 4:35 am

Terry, I can relate to where you are coming from, I took
some bashing as well on that thread, but I got over it quickly
and realized that not everyone is going to agree. You are
right though, Christians will be persecuted in various forms
for holding to their beliefs, even Jesus warned that his
followers would be persecuted for his namesake.
Back to the topic, I like how this new thread was renamed,
a little more dignity there.
Tardistraveler, thanks for the heads up at Yesworld about
the new tracks. It will be a "fresh of breath air" to hear
something new from Yes.

by **Terry Shea** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 5:50 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tardistraveler wrote:

To get back to the original topic, YesWorld has some information on the newly recorded tracks - check it out!
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>
Cool! Hopefully they'll make them available in another format though. I really don't want to have to buy another compilation album just to get some bonus material.

<hr>Listen to my music by clicking on one of these links:
http://www.ampcast.com/terry_shea
http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?so ... 268&T=3529
http://www.clearchannelnewmusicnetwork. ... /terryshea
http://www.mp3.com/terry_shea

by **innerPact** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 7:44 am

Personally, I quite enjoyed the previous thread and I learned a thing or two as well. (For example, the discussion of Jehovah's Witnesses between Henry & the Kid.)

I think this new version of the thread could be incredibly enlightening if we could all abide by a few simple rules of conduct which I suggest would simply be respect and tolerance for the different views of the contributors. It would be nice if we could all agree that religion is about faith and belief (and interpretation) as opposed to fact vs fiction and right vs wrong.

I'd also like to hear more from non-Christians.

by **tribute1969** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 7:54 am

Where's SAM KINISON when we need him??
Anyone got pics of Jessica Hahn???
Swaggart: Just The Tip????
Can't wait to see/hear what's "The Next BIG Thing"....

by **stevehoweistheMAN** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 7:55 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Megalodon wrote:
Terry, I can relate to where you are coming from, I took
some bashing as well on that thread, but I got over it quickly
and realized that not everyone is going to agree. You are
right though, Christians will be persecuted in various forms
for holding to their beliefs, even Jesus warned that his
followers would be persecuted for his namesake.
Back to the topic, I like how this new thread was renamed,
a little more dignity there.
Tardistraveler, thanks for the heads up at Yesworld about
the new tracks. It will be a "fresh of breath air" to hear
something new from Yes.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Megaladon,

I think that our converstaion in the previous post was going in circles, like you said, so maybe we should just keep our own opinions. I really enjoyed our converstaions though! You'll have to forgive me if I came across to harsh. I really didn't mean for you to be upset or take it personally. I LOVE debate, am in it at school, and when a deep juicy topic comes around, i get all fired up. I hope there's no harm done!

by **tardistraveler** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 8:51 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tribute1969 wrote:
Where's SAM KINISON when we need him??
Anyone got pics of Jessica Hahn???
Swaggart: Just The Tip????
Can't wait to see/hear what's "The Next BIG Thing"....
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Sam Kinison - guess according to your beliefs he's either in heaven, hell, purgatory, in line to be reincarnated, or no place at all!

Off-topic, but you reminded me - before his death Sam was starring in a show where he played the "conscience" of a businessman. The businessman would climb out onto the window ledge and have talks with Sam when things got crazy. Anyone else remember that show?

by **Megalodon** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 8:51 am

stevhoweistheMAN,
Thanks for the kind words. I did not take anything
personally at all and there is nothing wrong with
expressing your viewpoint and you didn't hurt my feelings
by no means. I enjoyed our conversation too, and I think
you do have alot of knowledge, and I respect your opinions
and you zeal.
I try not to get into debates about religion as 1 timothy
ch 6:4 warns us not to do that. But a good open minded
discussion can go a long way. Poloticians seem to get into
debates about words and it is fruitless, because they could
care less about what the other sais.<img src=pix/icon_yes_dragon.gif border=0 align=middle>

by **tardistraveler** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 8:54 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
stevehoweistheMAN wrote:
[quote]

Megaladon,

I think that our converstaion in the previous post was going in circles, like you said, so maybe we should just keep our own opinions. I really enjoyed our converstaions though! You'll have to forgive me if I came across to harsh. I really didn't mean for you to be upset or take it personally. I LOVE debate, am in it at school, and when a deep juicy topic comes around, i get all fired up. I hope there's no harm done!
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

I enjoyed hearing information about the various religions as well. I think topics like this can be debated as long as everyone realizes that no one is going to agree. So, we just agree to disagree up front, and learn some things from each other.

To me, the beauty of Yes music is that it purports a sense of spirituality without any particular religious beliefs being apparent. So, no matter what your religious belief, you can find something in Yes music that hits home.

by **tribute1969** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 12:28 pm

MY favorite SAM KINISON "show" was his HBO Special where there's a tape of him "preaching" when he was actually an "Holy Roller Evangelist"...and then he does his "standup show" where he talks about
D-I-V-O-R-C-E, Sex with the Dead and Religion-where he plays the part of Jesus at the Last Supper and being crucified on the cross....Hopefully IF there is a GOD, he/she has a "Sense of Humor" -for SAM's sake/soul.......
WILD THING......(found Jessica Hahn-she was in Sam's video of this re-make!!!LOL)

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tardistraveler wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tribute1969 wrote:
Where's SAM KINISON when we need him??
Anyone got pics of Jessica Hahn???
Swaggart: Just The Tip????
Can't wait to see/hear what's "The Next BIG Thing"....
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Sam Kinison - guess according to your beliefs he's either in heaven, hell, purgatory, in line to be reincarnated, or no place at all!

Off-topic, but you reminded me - before his death Sam was starring in a show where he played the "conscience" of a businessman. The businessman would climb out onto the window ledge and have talks with Sam when things got crazy. Anyone else remember that show?
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

by **tardistraveler** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 1:18 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tribute1969 wrote:
MY favorite SAM KINISON "show" was his HBO Special where there's a tape of him "preaching" when he was actually an "Holy Roller Evangelist"...and then he does his "standup show" where he talks about
D-I-V-O-R-C-E, Sex with the Dead and Religion-where he plays the part of Jesus at the Last Supper and being crucified on the cross....Hopefully IF there is a GOD, he/she has a "Sense of Humor" -for SAM's sake/soul.......
WILD THING......(found Jessica Hahn-she was in Sam's video of this re-make!!!LOL)

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Sex with the Dead? As in Grateful? or real dead bodies? That's a bit kinky even for me! LOL

And God MUST have a sense of humor he/she created US! :)

by **tribute1969** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 1:49 am

REAL DEAD FOLKS.....
Check THIS Out:
www.comedyontap.com/jokes/kinison/skjokes.html
<img src=pix/jestera.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=pix/salook.gif border=0 align=middle>

Website · by **OB1kenOB** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 1:50 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Terry Shea wrote:
... Why is it socially acceptable to bash Christians and not acceptable to bash other groups? ...<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

It’s interesting, entertaining, and sometimes enlightening to question rather than blindly accept. Sometimes people are uncomfortable with sincere questions about what the claim to believe, especially if their answers are unbelievable. I guess that might feel like “bashing” regardless of what “group” you belong to.
Outrageous, unbelievable claims prompt questions, so I guess a lot of people who claim to believe the Christian bible are going to feel “bashed”.
If I heard a stranger on the street make claims like…
) a man who was hundreds of years old single handedly built a wooden ship 450 ft long, 75 ft wide, and 45 ft high with three decks.
) a ship that size held inside it 8 humans, samples of every living species on the planet ( 2 of some, and 7 of others ), all the food and water these living things would need for over 13 months, samples of every plant.
) all of this stuff was loaded in this boat through one door in 7 days
) every living thing on this planet is genetically related to the species sample from that ship, including all races of humans emerging from 4 couples, of which all males where siblings except for their 600 year old dad.
I would certainly have some questions for that person regardless of what “group” he belonged to.
I just happens that the Christian bible contains a lot of accounts that can not take place in the real physical natural world, and even different groups of “Christians” disagree if it’s all unquestionable fact, or if some of it is metaphor, parable, illustrations of concepts, or just bad reporting.
We all have things we “know” and things we “believe”. True conviction in our beliefs takes that power away from the “bashing”.

<hr>http://kenrobertson.net
my YES site

"That which you are seeking is causing you to seek!"

by **tardistraveler** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 2:29 am

Ken, I enjoyed your post. I think people often fail to take into account that the Bible has endured for thousands of years in many permutations. It wasn't written as a single book, but is a compilation of many texts that were determined by some "board of authority" to be "scripture". The Catholic Bible contains books that do not appear in the Protestant Bible, because the Protestants chose to omit them, feeling they were not indeed "scripture". Who is right? Well, depends on your faith.

Then there's the issue of translations. The Bible has been translated many times, and there are variances from translation to translation. The much touted King James version was produced under the guidance of King James, who had his own slant on how the text should read. And we call this the divine word of God? Maybe, and maybe not - depends on how much interference the King provided.

Also with translations, there's the issue of understanding the original intent of the speaker. Someone who seemed to understand this issue was George Lamsa, who did a translation of the Bible taking into account the day-to-day usage of the language, the idioms, and such. Just think - thousands of years from now someone runs across a book which states "Keep your eyes peeled for that concert!" Or, "You're pulling my leg". If you translate those literally, the first one conjures an image of a very painful surgical procedure! The second one could connote an assault!

Then there's the issue of transcription. For years, the only way of preserving the texts was by scribes, who laboriously copied the pages. You can't convince me errors weren't made!

My point is, I guess, that although I feel the truth - whatever you perceive that to be - is IN the Bible, you may have to weed through a lot of fallacy and honest error to find it.

This is just MY opinion, and is not meant to denigrate anyone else's.

by **tardistraveler** » Sat Dec 13, 2003 2:32 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tribute1969 wrote:
REAL DEAD FOLKS.....
Check THIS Out:
www.comedyontap.com/jokes/kinison/skjokes.html
<img src=pix/jestera.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=pix/salook.gif border=0 align=middle>
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>

Seems like Sam Kinison had a unique perspective on this issue! If you check out the link - you'll see more examples of how it's hard to take the Bible as literal truth all the time!

Thanks for the link, Tribute!

by **tribute1969** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 11:06 am

GOT SNAKES?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

by **jeffrae** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 10:53 pm

You Killed my Creation...

You stunted its growing capabilities...

Started a new thread based off it?

Something smells fishy here.

Jeff

by **N2yes** » Wed Dec 17, 2003 11:08 pm

Nope, only revised it and tried to give it a bit more polish, Jeffrae. To save on bandwidth, we 'kill' ( actually lock ) threads that surpass the 200 mark and simply renew it, so to speak. No worries, it remains your creation.

<hr>"Master of images-Songs cast a light on you"

by **Megalodon** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:43 am

"In the Beginning, Jeffrae created the thread of all
threads"..<img src=pix/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

by **HoptownDon** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 8:14 am

That Sam Kinison Show was Called "Charlie Hoover" on Fox. He played Tim Matheson's alter ego. Played Zanie's in Nashille right after it was cancelled. Killed in a car wreck about 6 weeks later. BIG loss to comedy. Saw him perform 6 times.

<hr>"As God as my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." Arthur Carlson

by **tardistraveler** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 1:12 am

Thanks Don, for the info. I used to watch that show a lot. Yes, it was a loss when he died so unexpectedly.

Jeffrae - bet you didn't expect that thread to become a permanent fixture for religious discussion!

by **YesJo** » Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:37 am

You guys were talking religion all this time and I didn't even realize it, let me in! No, it's just that I find the topic fascinating. And it's amazing how many people there are in Christianity with sooooooo many different views. I consider myself a christian, but I liked what someone said about weeding thru alot to get to the truth in the bible.

Along with what (was it tardis) she said about the bible, there were also alot of things intended to go into the bible, but was not put in for political reasons. So what are we missing? What was left out. And what wasn't written. Can't there be mysteries still? I don't like it when people think that the bible holds ALL the answers. I'm sure God has alot of surpises up his sleeve.

The christian religion as we know it, was basically put together by Constantine who wanted to stop the killing between the christians and the pagans. So he merged the religions together and it looks alot like what we call christianity today. For example, Christ wasn't born on December 25, that was the pagan holiday of the sun or something like that, so he merged the two and now it's Christmas.

I think the bible has alot of knowledge in it, especially the New Testament, but I don't believe "In" the book, I believe in the man in the book. And if you take it word for word and try to read it in our modern context, it's a contradictory and confusing and often times frightening book.

I'm not saying that I think someone can't or shouldn't believe in the book, but I don't like it when someone tells me I'm not a real "believer" or a christian if I don't. And I'm not saved because I can't believe word for word about Noah's Ark Story like Ken said.

You can't ever tell me that there wasn't humen error, bias, sexual discrimination, things we cannot understand, things that are from such different cultures we can't compare it, etc........

So.....all that being said, I'm glad I finally clicked on this thread, thank you for having me!!!<img src=pix/icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>

by **tribute1969** » Sun Dec 28, 2003 7:44 am

CHECK THIS OUT....
www.ship-of-fools.com

by **tardistraveler** » Sun Dec 28, 2003 12:41 pm

Hey, they have a discussion board on that site! So, if anyone wants to really discuss religion - we can take it over there!

by **tardistraveler** » Mon Dec 29, 2003 11:52 pm

And I looked a little further last night - they have some interesting ideas about sexual activity.

Wonder what they use for communion service?

by **Terry Shea** » Tue Dec 30, 2003 2:36 am

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
tribute1969 wrote:
CHECK THIS OUT....
www.ship-of-fools.com
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote>I could have sworn it said "less crap" in the title of this thread, but I must be mistaken.

<hr>Listen to my music by clicking on one of these links:
http://www.ampcast.com/terry_shea
http://www.ic-musicmedia.com/terryshea
http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?so ... 268&T=3529
http://www.clearchannelnewmusicnetwork. ... /terryshea

by **tribute1969** » Thu Jan 01, 2004 1:17 am

BUT:
IT DID SAY "MORE FILLING"....On A Sailing "Ship" To Nowhere...lol
Now THIS is CRAP:
<img src="http://home.earthlink.net/~nolanpittman/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/blob.jpg" border=0>
<img src="http://home.earthlink.net/~nolanpittman/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/toiletzappa.jpg" border=0>
HAPPY NEW YEAR!<img src=pix/salook.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=pix/angel.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=pix/icon_smile_question.gif border=0 align=middle>

<hr>"WHAT WOULD OZZY DO?"

Holy Rollers and Music: Less Crap--More Filling

Holy Rollers and Music: Less Crap--More Filling

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