Terri Schindler-Schiavo

by **Roan's Lady** » Sat Mar 19, 2005 6:09 pm

Unless I'm misinterpreting or don't yet have all the facts, the news that her feeding tube was removed is simply horrific, and I cannot for the life of me understand it, unless she was suffering terribly. Doctors are saying there is a chance that she can be rehabilitated in some ways. She has some awareness and responsiveness, and is technically not in a vegetative state. There was no written directive for this to occur. I read somewhere about the "fine line" between removal of "life support" and removal of life-sustaining nutrients. Is this for real?? This is nothing short of murder - cruel and calculating at that! Apparently her "husband" has a girlfriend and has fathered two children since this tragic saga began. My heart aches for Terri and her family. Again, perhaps, I'm misinformed, or I don't know the entire story. Convince me that willfully and purposefully ending her life is justifiable! :mad:

by **yesman90125** » Sat Mar 19, 2005 8:05 pm

by **psychopomp95** » Sat Mar 19, 2005 8:47 pm

by **The Ancient** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 2:15 pm

I was told that the footage of her looking around (?) on ABC was spliced from many years of nothing but blank stares, and after all these years that's been about the only time she seemed to be alive at all. I just hope that what I heard is true, that her cerebral cortex does not function and she feels nothing. The husband spent years training himself as a coma nurse/therapist. He was offerred a large sum of money to transfer guardianship and could walk away many times but has refused. It sounds like he has kept the faith for a very long time. She got this way because of a self-induced anorexic collapse. She did not have a living will/power of attorney arrangement which commonly contains specific instructions regarding one's wishes if they end up in a situation like this. I suspect Ms. Schiavo has been gone for a long time, but that does not change the promise made for better or worse, in sickness and in health. Mrs. Ancient and I have power of attorney/living trusts and all of our friends and family know exactly what our wishes are if an unthinkable situation like this happens to one or the both of us. We made the in sickness and in health promise to each other, but we also understand that they can keep you alive long after you are gone so we made another promise to each other and our family: if I/we are brain-dead, the other should order comfort measures only. No feeding tubes, no respirators, no diapers, no lawyers, no bankruptcy, no TV cameras, no despair. It is our choice.

by **tribute1969** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 3:14 pm

Everyone should go re-read what "The Ancient's" have to say and follow their lead.... to avoid anything like this "situation" from every happening to you or your loved ones......and since the main "loved ones" in Terri's life so dramatically disagree about her "care and arrangements" coupled the absence of any pre-planning agreements I think the tube should stay in and her family-mother, father, brother should be allowed to continue with her "care"......
But it looks like "an act of Congress" will help decide for them all.....

by **psychopomp95** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 2:58 am

by **relayer4u** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:50 am

by **psychopomp95** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 6:09 am

by **Gary** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:01 pm

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by **tardistraveler** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:24 pm

Yes, that may be the lesson for ALL of us here - put our wishes in writing.

But, apparently Terri DIDN'T do that, so, who decides what is the right thing? Technically, her husband should have the legal right. However, her parents disagree with his decision, and in a matter of life and death, who's to say that they shouldn't have a say in this?

It would be nice if they ALL could come to a decision together - that they could all live with. Apparently this hasn't happened, so now it's in court. It's very sad.

I could voice my opinion here about what should be done, but MY opinion is irrelevant. I just hope that a decision can be brought about that's the best for all concerned.

I've been thinking about my OWN wishes since this case made the news, and it's really hard to decide at what point you would want treatment to stop. But, I'll keep thinking on it, and get something in writing ultimately, to spare J.J. an agonizing decision someday. I had to make that decision for both of my parents, and it was very hard. In those cases, my decision was to do what could be done with drugs and therapies, but to not resuscitate if their hearts stopped.

My heart goes out to Terri and her family, and I hope they can all find some peace.

by **in2yes** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 9:04 pm

by **yesman90125** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:27 am

by **yesman90125** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:39 am

by BE » Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:34 am

by **wild_westie** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:38 pm

by **psychopomp95** » Wed Mar 23, 2005 3:35 am

I think the point is being missed. This is NOT about "the right to die" (although the fact that the Republicans are turning it into this annoys the hell out of me, but what else should we expect from politicians?) - this is about proof that she really would have wanted to die if she ever ended up in a state like this in the first place! Since there IS no proof, no way in hell should her ex-husband have the right to pull the plug on her.
I'm the last one to say life and death is a black-and-white issue, but in terms of the legal aspect, it should remain so! If she still has a pulse, then she IS still alive, and no one, except for her, should have the right to let her die (unless they had her written permission). And anyways, if it's really true that she feels no pain, how the hell does she apparently respond to various ailments that have afflicted her in the past 15 years? Letting her die would be very cruel.

Oh, and Gary, you make some interesting points about the precedent this sets if they don't let her (ex-)husband do as he desires - maybe you're right, but IMO it's a MUCH more dangerous precedent if a judge rules that someone can end your life without your written consent. That borders on permissable murder!
I still say, much like BE does: if he doesn't want to support her anymore, fine, but why won't he let her parents have custody again??

Let's please try to avoid turning this into a partisan issue. It is SO far from that it's not even funny - and everytime I hope politicians might just have a bit of humanity in them, they turn situations like this into a chance to amass votes (I'm not surprised by it, just continually disappointed).

by **wild_westie** » Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:07 am

by BE » Wed Mar 23, 2005 9:18 pm

I also heard the nurse say that Michael "injected Terri with insulin",a drug she didnt need or use....

What happens if she now dies a slow painful death. Her parents could probably sue for a number of reasons like: murder,wrongful death, painful death,inhuman treatment,lose of their child,pain and suffering,etc!Michael,the hospital,doctors,judges,state,county,etc.all could share in the blame!

by **EricBliss12345** » Wed Mar 23, 2005 11:27 pm

If that woman has even a teeny fraction of a functioning brain she's probably wondering why in the hell they've kept her in such an unlivable state for so fucking long.

They should remove her life support, not starve her to death. Like she hasn't been through enough already. However, I don't know if starving to death and being miserable for a week would be any worse than living ANOTHER 15 years in that state. An awful way to do it but a better way than how it was being done if you ask me. Unfortunately, "better" doesn't necessarily mean "acceptable."

What a fuck-all of a situation huh?

by **Ed1909** » Wed Mar 23, 2005 11:39 pm

by **wild_westie** » Thu Mar 24, 2005 3:00 am

by **SightOfSeeds** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:16 am

this is murder pure and simple,while not being pure in the least and certainly not simple...i am disgusted and saddened with the inhumane manner our "justice" system is handeling this horrific situation...while we as human beings can not give Terri justice for the awful turn of events in her life (that is up 2 the Cosmic Court,if you will) we can however give some 2 her family by simply allowing a woman they so desperatly love and care for the right she has 2 LIVE!!...Terri needs no machines 2 make or even help her 2 breath or her heart 2 pump,the woman is not dying!!...oh,yes thats right,she is now!! why??because they took away her feeding tube,the only thing she needs beside the clear and obvious love her family has 4 her 2 contine the birthright she was gifted with by all of creation,LIFE!!...i'm so sick of the argument "i wouldn't want 2 live like that",well hey,neither would i,who would??...tho Terri didn't conciously make the choice 2 live this way,it was a horrible circumstance of fate...we are talking about a beautiful and may i add INNOCENT woman who's existance has so much worth that threads in the tapestry of the HER life have found thier way into OURS...who does not have an opinion on this?? which of us has not,even if only thru brief glances into our phyche,appplied her familys situation and HER existance 2 that of our very own??...i don't think the issue of her husbands rights being taken away from him by deciding whether she live or die should even be an issue,he can go on with his life as he pleases,he already has...if there were no one else interested in her care then sadly but assuredly this event would have passed unnoticed by almost everyone...tho that is not the case,she has a wonderful caring family who are willing 2 support and care 4 her,so by any sence of justice there may be,the right 2 care 4 her should be relinquished 2 her family!!...her body has functioned just fine this way with the simple assitance of being fed thru a tube because as part of her condition she lost the ability 2 swallow,which thru therapy denied by her husband in writting she may have been able 2 regain...so,even if you would not wish 2 "live like that",would you then prefere 2 be starved 2 death slowly??...QUALITY of life does NOT constitute END of life!!(that bares repeating so read it again :cool:

)...should we not then value life at whatever cost possible,so long as life is being prolonged and not the process of death being prolonged??...my vote?? well indeed,it's "Survival"

... willing you ALL,along with Terri and her family LOVE,LIFE and PEACE,Luna

by **keric** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 4:57 am

Where to start, where to start. This is not murder. This is a husband who knows, as anyone who is married knows, what his wife and he talked about in their most private talks. Now he has spent 15 years trying to carry out HER wishes. This isn't about whether she CAN be kept alive, but rather WOULD she want to be kept alive if this was her life. She told him no. I've told my wife no. For 15 years, through all attempts to stop him from doing so, he's shown his love for her by trying to carry out HER wishes. Imagine if you were in his shoes and believed that after this life you would be reunited in heaven with those you loved. How would he answer her if he had to face her and told her he gave up on her wishes and allowed her to be kept in what must be a living hell. Is there anyone who thinks that they wouldn't be insane by now if for 15 years all they could do was stare out at the people you love. No ability to interact, no means by which to communicate. I find those that would demand she be kept alive in this state to be much crueler than those that would let her pass on to whatever faces us after this life.
Years ago my wifes family faced the same situation with my father-in-law. They removed his feeding tubes. There was no media circus. No emergency congressional session. No presidential flights to Washington to sign a bill on his behalf. No right to life protesters outside the hospice he was in. Just my wife and her family carrying out the wishes of the father they loved.
I would hope people would stop reading in their own private prejudices against this man, who admittedly has moved on in his private life, as I hope my wife would do. He has kept the one last commitment he can to Terri. For 15 years he's tried to let her move on and not remain trapped in a physical condition none of us would wish on any person we love. This was her desire. She told her husband this was her desire. Let Terri move on to whatever faces us after this life.

by **psychopomp95** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 11:46 am

If it IS true then I would certainly understand it... but the problem is, there is no written proof that she said such a thing. I understand the argument, but without PROOF that she would want to die, why is this situation unfolding like it is??

by **yesman90125** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 6:56 pm

by **keric** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:54 pm

by **in2yes** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 7:58 pm

by **yesman90125** » Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:36 am

by **relayer4u** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:15 am

by **yesman90125** » Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:21 am

Terri Schindler-Schiavo

Terri Schindler-Schiavo

This was my post in the Same Sex Union thread:

There is so much more to consider!

On it goes..........

You know

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